Unnatural Vegan vs VeganGains

Unnatural Vegan holds a pro-natalist position and she is willing to distort reality to convince herself that having children is a great choice for most people.

Unnatural Vegan vs VeganGains

Unnatural Vegan holds a pro-natalist position and she is willing to distort reality to convince herself that having children is a great choice for most people.

71 thoughts on “Unnatural Vegan vs VeganGains

  1. “It is curious that while good people go to great lengths to spare their children from suffering, few of them seem to notice that the one (and only) guaranteed way to prevent all the suffering of their children is not to bring those children into existence in the first place.”-David Benatar

    1. The question is whether or not you value wellbeing.

      If so, bring children into the world, bring them up to be decent, confident, well-adjusted members people who’ll contribute positively to society and have a good chance of living a full happy life.

      If not, why bother doing anything whatsoever? Why bother typing? Why bother eating or drinking or using your muscles when you’re such a hopeless nihilist that every move is an act of hypocrisy? What are you other than an intellectual cancer eating away at the rest of humanity and trying to metastasise over the internet? Not meaning to be rude, but…

    2. “Bring children into this world. Bring them up to be decent, confident well adjusted members people who’ll contribute to society and have a good chance of living a full and happy life.”
      You can be the best parent and still not guarantee any of these things. Your child could develop a cure for cancer, or be responsible for a holocaust. They could be the happiest person on earth, or die at 7 years old from terminal cancer. How can you guarantee a full happy life? What is a fully happy life? What someone considers happiness is very subjective. I could be happy playing basketball, someone else can be happy killing animals. Sure being a great parent helps, but that’s far from a guarantee. You take a huge risk by bringing another person into this world, a risk you won’t have to pay the consequences for. If you want to do your best in raising a contributing member of society there are plenty of children that need homes and loving parents. But I will not roll the dice with another persons life that doesn’t ask to be here.
      I eat to avoid hunger, I drink to avoid thirst. I’m trying to escape pain not live with it.
      I am not at all a nihilist. Would a nihilist value another sentient conscious beings life experience? Would a nihilist care about another beings pain and suffering? That matters to me. I take another sentient beings welfare very seriously. I value their subjective/objective experiences. I’m not doing anything other than questioning things that need to be questioned and taken seriously so I’m not sure why you’re attacking me personally. I’m not personally going through anything I would consider drastically uncomfortable and would consider myself a happy person, but that doesn’t mean that can’t change any day, that doesn’t mean I can’t feel empathy for another conscious beings suffering and that certainly doesn’t give me the right to create another being against their will.

    3. You can’t guarantee happiness since you’re not a god, however, you can do what you can to maximise the potential for happiness (wellbeing, really). And there’s no better way of doing this than bringing into the world a child that you love dearly.

      The fact that you can’t guarantee success and happiness in an endeavour is not a reason to avoid doing it. You could go to the party, but how can you guarantee that you won’t be mangled in a traffic accident on the way, or attacked by a crazy druggie? You can’t, but you go to the party anyway. It’s about risk assessment, and we do it every day of our lives.

      Adoption is a good thing, if you have what it takes, but most men don’t want to be cucks, they want to take care of their own children. There’s more love in a biological family. And regarding the biological family unit – the continuation of Western civilisation depends on it.

      Not attacking, but do you consider that your life hasn’t been worth living? Or that in the future you may decide that it was never worth living? It so, I sympathise.

    4. “You can do what you can to maximize the potential for happiness and threres no better way of doing that than bringing into the world a child you love dearly.”
      If you’re talking about my potential happiness I may experience by having a child that is the furthest thing from my mind and is certainly not a guarantee for the person that is thinking like that. If unnatural vegans child for example were to be diagnosed with cancer like the dozens of children that were diagnosed today, among many other things, would she still be “happy”? Would it all have been “worth it”? She won’t be the one dealing with that suffering directly even though she’s responsible for that outcome. I personally wouldn’t be able to live with myself.
      I am not concerned with the well being of someone that doesn’t exist. The absence of happiness for a nonexistent person is not harmful nor is it “bad”.
      “The fact you cannot guarantee success or happiness in an endeavor is not a reason to avoid doing it.”
      I agree. I personally like taking risks whether it comes to business, adventure, women etc. When I play basketball whatever comes of my decisions are consequences I’m willing to endure. I could tear my ACL etc. but when we are talking about another persons life, I would not consider bringing a person into existence a “personal” endeavor when there is a potential non consenting person that doesn’t even exist yet who isn’t asking to be here on the other end of that endeavor. The fact I can’t guarantee my biological child happiness is absolutely a valid reason not to gamble with their life. I will not directly have to deal with the outcome is enough reason for me to rethink that decision.
      “You can go to the party but how can you guarantee that you won’t be mangled in a traffic accident.”
      Again the discussion is not about me and my experiences. I am willing to take the risk of going to the party because I am willing to pay the consequences of my actions. I am not willing to drag someone along to a party that they didn’t ask to go to whether they like it or not. If I forced that person to go to that party against their will without asking me to go and that person had something terrible happen I will feel responsible for that persons harm.
      What I can guarantee is that my non existent child will never be mangled in a car accident or attacked by a druggie. They will never be kidnapped, raped, murdered etc. They will never be severely mentally challenged, chronically depressed, epileptic, paraplegic, morbidly obese etc. They don’t exist. They don’t need to exist. I have assessed the risk of bringing a person into the world and the price is too high.
      “There’s more love in a biological family” is another subjective experience. A person that adopts May feel more love for their child than a dead beat parent who had a child “by accident”, is not directly in their life and doesn’t care what happens to them. Some biological parents treat their children terribly or aren’t in their life at all. A person that adopts may also care more for that child than their biological parents, at the very least they are caring for them while their biological parents are not.
      I have no idea what life holds for me in the future, nobody really does. But that doesn’t mean I will lock myself in a basement to avoid any harms caused by the outside world. But conversations of what can happen to me aren’t the crux of the argument.
      I don’t like to delve into my personal life because it may deter from the argument. Sure going through hard times can lead you to such conclusions but it’s not mandatory. This isn’t a psychological issue it is a philosophical issue.
      But at the same time I’m not going to blame someone for being bothered by cruelty and suffering that they themselves might not be experiencing. I realize this is a very heavy issue to discuss and certainly not a very popular one, and I can see why someone would jump to the subject of depression which is an issue that needs serious attention in its own right, but it is a topic that needs to be discussed nonetheless. I am about truth and fairness and I believe it’s only fair to the person I’m considering bringing into existence to have a level of respect for their potential harms instead of the plight of western civilization.
      I’d rather focus on the person that will be created and the consequences that person may endure from my decision to create them. I’ll leave a link for a critique of the Sam Harris and Benatar discussion that I found insightful.
      https://youtu.be/9tJuMjvbNtQ
      Sorry if some of my points were all over the place have a good one.

    1. And it probably won’t double any more. Each organism reproduce when resources (environment capacity) allow it, it’s not other way around. Furthermore humans follow K-type selection strategy, so we have few children and invest a lot to raise them, and again we adapt to environment in that department too (maybe even overcompensating like mice in Calhoun’s experiment 😉 ). We have already surpassed a peak of the growth rate anyway and it drops steadily to 0.

    2. Herb Derb We are already over populated and the government’s are taking action. Why do you think the American governments aren’t regulating all the cancer causing chemicals in food and the fact that gmo corn fed to cats made them sterile after three generations makes it pretty clear.

  2. Love the content Richard and I can’t stand uv and her crappy content. It’s kind of funny tho when U talk ab uv and her looks but jasmine is like a less attractive flat chested version of old buck tooth unnatural vegan. I think you should go after some of the other ytubers out there too. This was pretty funny tho. I’d stay away from talking ab girls looks until jasmine gets in better shape and gets a job.

    1. he really doesn’t have a leg to stand on attacking any woman’s looks with a fugly wife (who looks this bad in her prime years of 20s), but Jas-man is the closest thing to fucking a dude without going full homo

    1. While not exactly attractive, UV nevertheless clearly looks like a woman (i.e. nothing at all like Harry Potter) so naw, I’m guessing Richard is not interested.

    1. no it is not relevant to anything in this video he also apologized for insulting his wife dude like how is him insulting LF wife relevant bro

    2. how is it fake and he insulted lex in the video not his wife why are you focusing on LF this video has zero to do with him it is about children why they do not have them and maybe why you should not have them

    1. Bruce S “Travel to Syria and join Isis” Ah Bruce, are you projecting here? You obviously do not have a place in society otherwise you wouldn’t waste so much of your precious on trying to trigger people in the comment section of VG’s videos. Joining ISIS won’t give your life a purpose, Bruce. Just seek professional help.

    2. Springfairy92 uv is much cuter than jasmine. yes, this matters, but only for like, hmmm, 95%. looks over everything! wanna watch some garbage “next topmodel” with me? 😉

  3. No offense dude but your wife isn’t exactly a 10.

    Seeing how you can barely keep your apartment clean, I can see why you should never have children.

    1. Ahil Ahmed I wish I was as high as you. She is ugly. She could do a couple of things to make herself more attractive but she’s not pretty

    2. Humanless God a dirty apartment is an unkempt lifestyle. Taking care of children requires organization and cleanliness. An untidy environment is bad for a child’s mental and physical health. Ya we have dirty homes and the children in them statistically turn into shitheads and criminals.

      One of the exercises given to at risk orphans from abusive homes to help them mentally is to practice cleanliness like making a bed, look it up.

    1. No, Sea Witch. 426 09 is correct in saying that making youtube videos is his job, people donate so he continues to make youtube videos that mainly center around the topic of veganism however that doesn’t necessarily mean every video is going to be about veganism, he’s branched into other topics and styles of videos in the past as well. And some of the ones that he makes that are about veganism aren’t necessarily supposed to be about “vegan activism”, other vegan youtubers including Unnatural Vegan do this as well.

    2. creepybeaver3981 without his Patreon, he wouldn’t be able to support himself and his wife on YouTube’s ad revenue. He’d likely get another job, maybe quit youtube altogether. His patrons pay him to spread the vegan message, not to defend his life choices.

    3. Sea Witch What’s the matter with you? Why is his existence pathetic? Why are you so triggered about something so meaningless? Great, the guy does not want to have kids. Isn’t this like his choice? Am I missing something here?

  4. Your worst video to date, in fact this is the only video I’ve really had an issue with in the two years of watching you. I figured this was an actual live debate but it was just you going over a video you already dealt with, 3 hours of meaningless squabbling.

    1. I didn’t already deal with this video and I don’t see how this how this was meaningless. She made ridiculous claims about parenting and the environmental impact of having children that are worth refuting.

    2. Vegan Gains You did though? I watched either a live stream or actual video of you responding to her video on you pretty close to when she originally uploaded it. I agree with you almost entirely with the actual content of your original video but this upload didn’t add anything to the conversation.

  5. some people like it more to travel and do lots of stuff, other people like me just like to be at home or do things with family 🙂

  6. Autism is often not problematic at all. In my entire life I have met 1 person with autism, who was in my class, but it was very mild and he was one of my best friends in school. Severe cases are more rare and more challenging obviously

    1. Swordkiller I don’t want to assume you mean kill autist ppl, so can you elaborate on your comment, primarily on that second paragraph. Thank you

    2. I personally think children in general are difficult to deal with. My daughter has moderate to severe Autism and is far better behaved than most neurotypical children. She is non verbal but she is also not aggressive like some children with severe Autism and behavioural issues. All depends on what you are willing to risk. My child personally for me is worth it. Im glad richard isn’t having kids as he has no interest in children. People who want children are the ones who should have them, otherwise i would highly suggest against having children. to each their own.

    3. I’m from multi generational autism lineage. They had TONS of labels for people on the “spectrum” before autism. In my case my family is low IQ highly physically violent from lack of coping skills. I was just like them until I meet a friend who got me to change my diet. 3 years later , I’m now functionally vastly improved. Night and day difference. I have been able to educate my self at a insanely fast rate. I couldn’t even read 3 years ago. I got a high school diploma and decided I didn’t want college as books are cheap and I can teach myself. My diet is still changing but, for mental/emotional issues I’d say I’m “cured”. Look into what the hell you feed your kids and monitor the effects. In my case any gluten, sugar, or dairy causes severe mental issues. Nightshades also cause aggression. It’s a full time job monitoring diet but it’s worth it.

    4. Genius Idiot yes my daughter would sit in a corner and not communicate at all or make eye contact. After I cut out gluten and dairy she started to come out of her shell she now knows her Abc’s 1-20 shapes colors and makes more eye contact doesn’t hide in a corner. All in a span of 12-18 months. I wholly agree with the diet having an affect on those with asd.

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